R1a Project

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Michał Milewski Michał Milewski
October 23, 2016 @ 6:14am
Dear Project Members! Before you ask any questions here, please read the following instructions posted on an R1a project blog that is run by our co-admin Artur Martyka: http://r1aproject.blogspot.com/2016/02/normal-0-21-false-false-false-pl-x-none_9.html http://r1aproject.blogspot.com/2016/03/normal-0-21-false-false-false-pl-x-none.html http://r1aproject.blogspot.com/2016/03/basic-understanding-of-categories-you.html http://r1aproject.blogspot.com/2016/11/ordering-and-comparison-of-single-snps.html If you are a new project member, please go to our project's DNA Results page (https://www.familytreedna.com/public/r1a/default.aspx?vgroup=r1a&section=yresults) to see which specific category you have been assigned to by our admin team based on your STR and SNP results (this will also show our specific recommendations for your further testing). You may wish to increase the size of that page (from 500 to 8500) to see your STR haplotype being shown among all remaining haplotypes belonging to our project's members (otherwise you will need to visit all subpages one by one before finding your STR haplotype placed in a specific category). In case the classic chart doesn't work (for some technical reasons), try the colorized chart instead (page size 15000). Keep in mind that it may take a day or two before your newly joined/received results are assigned to a proper category by one of our admins, so please be patient. Also, you need to stay logged in (as a project member) to see the results of all project members, including those who don't want their results to be seen by non-members. This includes your own result in case you have not made it available to all visitors. In case you don't have any STR results (which concerns many people who have transferred their Genographic results to FTDNA), you should consider ordering at least 37 (and better 67 or 111) Y-DNA STR markers, which is needed to assign you to a specific category and to make any specific advice regarding your further testing. Thank you for joining us in our quest to investigate our shared deep paternal ancestry!
David Miller
April 12 @ 9:58am
WHY ISN'T THERE A SEARCH FUNCTION ON THE DNA RESULTS PAGE? Or, in group messages? I get tired of scrolling through the pages looking for an account number, surname or Haplogroup numbers.
Novruz Yunis
April 12 @ 10:08am
To my problem. And i don not know a english. The rule applies to 2016.
Michael Wilson
April 18 @ 8:25pm
I see some of the R1a Administrators are also administrators on the YFull R1a group I just made a request to join. Look forward to hearing from you guys.
David Miller
April 20 @ 2:17pm
I learned from other members, one can use CTRL + F for find on some pages.
Artur Martyka Artur Martyka
May 29, 2018 @ 12:50pm
*IMPORTANT* Dear R1a Project members You may have recently read about or heard of a number of changes to projects and privacy settings of all FTDNA Testers. (This is a new law - GDPR - which has begun). For me, the most important thing you can do for me right now, is to log into your FTDNA personal home page and hover your cursor over your name on the top right hand side and click on <Privacy and Sharing> and work through the privacy options. When complete, click on the tab right next to the <Privacy and Sharing> called <Project Preferences> For R1a Project that I administer along with other staff members, please click on “EDIT” then grant me ‘Limited Access’. (Full access is available only if you give me your kit number and password). Please grant access also to other staff members of R1a Project, all if possible. Otherwise, we won't be able to work on the haplotypes of some project members, whose profiles are locked. Best,
Jordi Mestres
November 27 @ 12:39pm
This is indeed a very nice way to summarise the main R1a clades, made by one of the Administrators of this R1a project. Many thanks for that! Unfortunately, it is over 3 years old and lots of new subclades are known today that were not known back in 2016. In fact, the potential degree of granularity that one could achieve with current subclade knowledge would perhaps require splitting that R1a general YTree at least into the 4 main clades that emerged 3,000 years ago: L664, Z284, Z280, and Z2124. In 3-5 years from now, the depth of knowledge on many branches may potentially allow for learning about the exact SNP and the very moment when lineages split into different surnames.
NFI Vance
November 27 @ 8:06pm
Donald Stassel
February 26 @ 6:54pm
NFI Vance, THANK YOU VERY MUCH! This is a beautiful diagram and very well organized. Kudos to the graphic designer and for all the people who contributed to its data.
NFI Vance
March 5 @ 6:46am
You are very welcome Donald. Happy to share. And Jordi - you don't know what you are talking about. It's not designed to go into total detail. That is not its purpose and if you want excruciating detail go to YFull and see the whole tree.
Wajih Al-Mousa Wajih Al-Mousa
23 hours ago
Hi All, I always had a strong doubt about the accuracy of family tree dna matches. So, I started investigate myself. I checked my matches how had done big Y. Two of them their result was R-FT203945 while the other was R-YP1145. I compared these results to mine, I found it is impossible to be my matches on 25 markers as FAMILY TREE DNA shows. This is how I found out. My Haplogroup is R-M207 > R-M173 > R-M420 > R-M459 > R-M198 > R-M417 > R-PF6162 > R-Z283 > R-Z282 > R-Y17491> R-YP4858 > R-FT114402. While the first two Haplogroup was R-M207 > R-M173 > R-M420 > R-M459 > R-M198 > R-M417 > R-PF6162 > R-Z283 > R-Z282 > R-Y2395 > R-Z289 > R-Z284 > R-Z288 > R-Z287 > R-CTS8277 > R-YP1258 > R-FT205936 >R-FT203945 . as you see our MRCA was R-Z282 which is more than 4800 years old, so impossible to be my matches on 25 markers. The other one was R-M207 > R-M173 > R-M420 > R-M459 > R-M198 > R-M417 > R-PF6162 > R-Z283 > R-Z282 > R-Z280 > R-CTS1211 > R-Y10805 > R-YP1145 and also our MRCA was R-Z282. I also found a guy whose Haplogroup was R-M207 > R-M173 > R-M420 > R-M459 > R-M198 > R-M417 > R-PF6162 > R-Z283 > R-Z282 > R-Y17491> R-YP4858 not my matches even on 12 markers although it is clear that he is more relative for me than the first ones .
1 Comment
Wajih Al-Mousa
20 hours ago
Is it possible that someone who have MRCA more than 4800 years old to be your 25 markers matches ?
NFI Vance
16 hours ago
Yes. Homoplasy is a common thing in DNA testing. What that means in particular is that STR testing has limits. Some people of very different YDNA haplogroups have common STR values. In my case I was first assigned to R-Z93, and after some SNP specific testing, that turned out to be very wrong (I'm Z92 which split with Z93 6000 years ago). Again, because of common STR values that are part of very different legs of the YDNA haplotree. FTDNA does a decent job on deep ancestry with STR testing, but to really get it right, you have to do Big-Y or SNP specific testing. I hope that helps.
Wajih Al-Mousa
10 hours ago
@ Vance , I already did Big-Y and all the other guys I mentioned they had done Big-Y.
Jordi Mestres
4 hours ago
This is something I have been telling FTDNA for years. My 12-marker matches are so remote that some of them do not even share my haplotype! And this is because STRs go up and down and, unless you are within genealogical times, matches have no sense at all. In contrast, the average 25-marker distance with my closest matches by SNP is 7 and they are not even considered as matches, so you cannot contact them! I believe FTDNA knows perfectly the situation but they are treating their customers as ignorants to just have fun with it and tell them they have some matches.
Aleksandr Mitrofanov Aleksandr Mitrofanov has a question!
April 20 @ 1:57am
Уважаемые администраторы. мой КИТ IN71009 и он не классифицирован. В другой базе он отнесен к Z283>Z282>Z280>S24902>. Тот же результат дает кластерный анализ с Вашей базой. Просьба провести классификацию и посоветовать дальнейшие мои действия. Спасибо.
Wladyslaw Janik
May 18 @ 12:36pm
Snip (haplogrupę) miał starożytny człowiek z Gustorzyna nad Wisłą, region Kujawy. Dla żartu nazwałem go swoim wujkiem, bo jest z bratniej linii mojego praojca CTS1211. Człowiek z Gustorzyna, S24902, jest umowsnie nazwany ojcem starożytnej kultury trzcinieckiej, bałtosłowiańskiej. Gratuluję Ci!
Aleksandr Mitrofanov
June 4 @ 4:12am
Boris Stefanov Boris Stefanov
June 1 @ 3:06pm
N268045 BigY done. Can you sort the results please?
Sergei Leonov
June 2 @ 7:36am
Hi Boris! Your clade is CTS1211. Could you write to Artur, please? The communication with him through R1a Group in Facebook or personally would be the best way.
Boris Stefanov
June 3 @ 12:05am
Done. Thanks Sergei!
Boris Stefanov Boris Stefanov
June 1 @ 8:19pm
Seeking other FGC70012 to try and find some rhyme or reason in our postulated common origins
Sergei Leonov Sergei Leonov
May 16 @ 2:53pm
Dear Project Members! We hope the situation with Member Subgrouping will be resolved soon. FTDNA team informs us: "We apologize for the inconvenience, as there is a glitch in the system with the member subgrouping page. Our IT department is well aware of the situation, and is working on getting it resolved."
Sergei Leonov
May 18 @ 2:02pm
That bug is fixed. The more solid upgrade will take some time. if anyone has any suggestions regarding M458>CTS11962 (L1029+YP515), then write to me freely. I'll do my best.
Sergei Leonov
May 24 @ 3:22am
CTS11962 (L1029+YP515) is OK now.
Sergei Leonov
May 31 @ 1:26pm
Today I finished the prediction of Ungrouped by STR markers and added our probable CTS11962+ to our tabs. But BigY (or SNP testing) only could confirm (or sometimes refute) this prediction. BigY is the only way to breakthrough in phylogeny.
Adam Golinowski Adam Golinowski
May 20 @ 3:26am
Hi, Wonder why there are differences in projects...? You project (R1a1a) - L260>YP256>YP254>Y2905>Y23580>Y23110 Others projects... (L260) - L260>YP256>YP254>YP616>Y2905>Y23580>Y23581>Y23110 (R1a and all subclades Y) - L260+ YP256+ YP254+ Y2905+ Y23110 (FamilyTreeDNA) - L260>YP256>YP254>FT5104>Y2905>Y23110 (YFull) - L260>YP256>YP254>Y2905>Y23110 Best,
1 Comment
Stephen Socci
May 20 @ 5:03pm
The terminal SNP is what matters most. The other build the tree down the trunk, so to speak, and may have been left out by a project. Google R-Y23110.
Adam Golinowski
May 21 @ 4:21pm
I don't really understand this answer, but it is not important here… ;)
Mark Barta
May 31 @ 12:22am
The L260 project is starting to include most of the named SNP's near the terminal branch, not just the branch names. Most other projects will just use the "branch name" and not include the other SNPs. Also in the mix are SNP groupings that were named at points in the past and not had their name updated anytime recently because there either has been no reason to do so, or for various other reasons. This can apply within a single group project just as easily as it can between projects. Also the admins involved in each project can often differ, which means methodologies will often change between them. As already mentioned, the only one that truly matters is the Terminal Haplogroup.
Adam Golinowski
May 31 @ 4:59am
Mark, thanks for such extensive argumentation. I understand this important issue here. Nevertheless, it is quite misleading for most "clients", these "great" optimists... I noticed, for example, that some of them (without Big Y test)... on "FamilyTreeDNA" have recently been withdrawn, from Y-Z283 to Y-M198, or 7,000 years, and... almost to the Middle East! :O Well, we can expect everything...
NFI Vance NFI Vance
May 28 @ 9:30pm
So I got a nice email from FamilyTreeDna informing me that I had another (2nd) 12 YSTR match. This match connects with me 6000 years ago. Hurrah! How exciting. Not. Sorry guys, but this is just not working. You do deep ancestry very well thank you. At least for this R-Z92 (R1a) guy, more modern stuff, not so well. Not sure what it takes to bridge the gap, but to be plain, Ancestry is kicking your ___ on the genealogical side. Maybe your pricing model needs looked at so you actually connect people? Just a thought.
Marcel Ulverskiold Nordstierneheim
May 29 @ 2:49am
Bud!! Take that with FTDNA and not with the group as the group have nothing to do with the company....
Thomas Brown
May 29 @ 2:54am
So, what is it you're trying to accomplish here, NFI? Sounds like you're looking for a bunch of fourth cousins, and you'll find plenty of them with Ancestry (which it also sounds as though you've already done). Ancestry is an autosomal test; so is FTDNA's Family Finder. The test you're complaining about, however, is a paternal test so it's apples against oranges from the git-go. And since I just brought that up, were you aware you can transfer Ancestry's autosomal results to FTDNA's Family Finder? For free? Or, you can give FTDNA $29, and they'll turn on all their bells & whistles for you. Just don't try to do that at Ancestry; by their own choice, Ancestry does not play well with others. As you've noted somewhat sarcastically, FTDNA's Y-DNA testing does the deep stuff rather well. It should, because that's what it was meant to do. They're the guys who 20 years ago literally invented this business, Ancestry once tested Y-DNA (they once tested mt-DNA, too). The key word there is "once." I guess neither Y-DNA nor mt-DNA fit Ancestry's show-biz approach to genealogy. I have two sets of Ancestry Y-46 results -- my late father's & my own -- just sitting in a dead-letter box at Ancestry -- totally unsupported by them! Whose ___ is getting kicked now? Mine, I guess. It would be great to reference my father's kit number at FTDNA, then plug Dad's Big Y-700 into my growing collection of Brown R1a results; too bad I sent his spit to Ancestry . . . Look, each of these tests has a place and time, and with some I'll admit I'm still trying to find the right place and right time. Do Y-12 matches annoy you? Turn them off. I only look at those which share my surname. I'm annoyed by 6 cM matches at Ancestry, too, but I still check to see if we might have matches in common. In the end, you're only going to get from this what your willing to put into it. And from where I stand, it doesn't seem as though you're willing to invest very much.
NFI Vance
May 29 @ 7:40pm
Willing to invest very much? God, are you stupid or what Thomas? You know what a BigY costs? Been there, done that. SNP tests, and upgrades? Yep. YSTR testing? Ancestry too? Pay to send it to YFull? Done that too. And I already said FTDNA does the deep ancestry OK. Please learn to read.
Radoslaw Piwowarczyk Radoslaw Piwowarczyk
January 28 @ 3:11am
Radoslaw Piwowarczyk
January 29 @ 4:46am
2x R1a-L1029 (grave 58B - 1140±30 BP, grave 47 - 1090±30 BP), strontium isotope ratios - both non-local, possibly from Scandinavia (but from different regions), grave 58A - mother of 58B with local North Polish strontium isotope ratios, 47 could be a son of 58B 1x R1b-FGC11293 (grave 43 - 1100±30 BP) - non-local 1x R1b-U106 (grave 35 - 1065±30 BP) - non-local Age distribution of buried: 58B - maturus/senilis 47 - maturus 43 - maturus 35 - maturus/senilis https://i.postimg.cc/PfYjJRxf/20200128-062506.jpg Grave 58 https://i.postimg.cc/ZRbzQrpk/Ciep-e-2-960px.jpg Other R1a-L1029 samples from "Population genomics of the Viking world", e.g. from Funen, Denmark https://i.postimg.cc/PH2H66ZB/Screen-Hunter-2768-Jul-18-09-06.jpg All the samples are autosomally Polish-like... https://i.postimg.cc/v8d98B1D/Screen-Hunter-2768-Jul-18-11-12.jpg
Radoslaw Piwowarczyk
May 24 @ 12:44am
Robert Willy Bjarkøy/ Bjarköy/Bjarkoey Robert Willy Bjarkøy/ Bjarköy/Bjarkoey has a question!
May 5 @ 5:59pm
Hello, all. This is Trine writing, Robert's daughter. I admin his dna accounts. I have a question that I know is a shot in the dark, but I wanted to see if there is any possibility, statistically if nothing more, to make an assupmtion on this matter. Your thoughts are very welcome. So, Robert's father is unknown. Let's call him Willi. He was German! Robert has taken 4 autosomal dna tests and 2 Ydna, incl Y700. His Ydna is R-Y39004. His matches (with exception from 1 who may be a 1C1R) are only distant matches, and show geographical clusters: Pomerania (Cammin, Naugard, Greifenberg etc) and East Prussia (Niederung, Heydekrug, Tilsit etc). I have, maybe wrongly, but because so far the matches from the two geographical clusters do not match each other, concluded it is likely that one of Willi's parents was Pomeranian and the other East Prussian. My question is: Knowing that Robert's, and Willi's, Ydna is R-Y39004, "East Pomeranian branch", is it more likely that Willi's father was from the Pomeranian cluster or from the East Prussian cluster?? Trine
Robert Willy Bjarkøy/ Bjarköy/Bjarkoey
May 7 @ 6:40pm
@Leon BUYNEVIĆ, haha, yes, you are right, there are many with slavic sounding surnames on his match lists on Ydna. Not many on autosomal lists though (yes, some!) I agree with the reasoning. I have a gut feeling that my unknown granddad has s trong ties to that geographical area. We ahve so many matches with family from East Prussia (all of family of our best match is from there), into Lithuania. Therefor I suspect this to be the paternal family of my Opa, and his mother being Pomeranian. But I find no surnames from the tree of the best match (east prussia) in any of the many, many trees of autosomal matches on all the sites where Robert is tested. I can only believe that the right people are not tested, and / or my Opa is " illegitimate" or maybe adopted not having the name of his birth family. (We were given a name by my Oma, but NOONE of the tens of thousands of matches have this name in their trees.
David Miller
May 11 @ 6:22am
I second NFI Vance's comments about Ancestry. I have GEDCOM files and DNA tests on Ancestry. Uploaded to GEDmatch, My Heritage, Family Search and FTDNA. Since mid-2019, Ancestry has added significantly more and better search tools. For instance it is possible to search for a village name and nothing else. It does require members to include this info in their profile or on their Family Tree. FTDNA tests are very complex. Number of persons in the database is relatively small. I initially took the Y-111 test. Later realized it covers about 8,000 years bpy (before present year). Decided to take Big 700. Only found 4 FTDNA members that were 300 years bpy or closer. Only 1 replied to my inquiry. I also uploaded my FTDNA Big Y 700 and full mtDNA results to YFULL for additional cost. Still trying to learn how best to use the information. Best advice I've had was to upload my DNA file to as many sites as you can afford. Corollary is to spend a LOT of time writing to potential relatives. Only about 15% reply, even for ones with DNA matches.
Robert Willy Bjarkøy/ Bjarköy/Bjarkoey
May 23 @ 1:41pm
@Sabri Kahraman: Robert's mother is Norwegian and her dna has likely nothing closely related with any of Robert's father's relatives. I have had a few men testing for Ydna, Pomeranians, but they were R1b. I can not afford to test anyone more untill i feel like I am closer to his actual family. We are rather close to th East Prussian family, but they hesitate to test autosomal. I would not dare to ask for a Y test untill I see what the @dna brings.
Robert Willy Bjarkøy/ Bjarköy/Bjarkoey
May 23 @ 1:46pm
@David Miller, I uploaded to all sites between 1,5-2,5 years ago. Only one possible 1C1R (and his daughter and grandson) found so far (East Prussians). Rest are only very distant matches, on ALL sites.
R. Jones R. Jones
May 18 @ 3:12pm
My Big Y-700 results are in. My father and I share the same terminal SNP (FT33212) as kit 751380: 5. ...>Z283>Z282>Z280>S24902>YP561>YP564>YP4668>YP4664* 751380 Olaf Jacobsen,b 1845 Aker, Oslo R-FT33212 5. ...>Z283>Z282>Z280>S24902>YP561>YP564>YP4668>YP4664*-A (YP4664 not tested; Big Y-700 needed) 169685 William Jones, 1626-1687 R-M198 154059 William Jones, b. 1630 and d. 1687 R-FT33212
Jordi Mestres
May 19 @ 6:07am
Yes. It looks like you found a 3000-year old cousin from Norway.
Jordi Mestres
May 19 @ 6:07am