FLEMING DNA PROJECT UPDATES - 08/13/2015

A direct male descendant of Elijah Andrew Fleming (1865) was located and tested.  His DNA test results matched the other tested male descendants of Frederick's two other sons, John Jefferson and Solomon, but did not match the other tested male descendants of Robert Fleming (1773).  Therefore the conclusion is inevitable that an event outside of marriage took place prior to the birth of Frederick.  Additional DNA testing of the direct male descendant of Elijah Andrew Fleming firmly matches men with the Owens surname -- providing confirmation that the biological father was not Robert Fleming.  

While 'Big Y' testing of 2 or more of the direct male descendants of Robert Fleming would probably not help in determining who Robert's father or grandfather were -- it would concretely identify which sub-branch of the M222 Tree the line should be placed, as well as possibly identifying any mutations now unknown that would be unique to the Robert Fleming genetic lineage.  Now, or in the future, if others show the same mutations, it would be likely that they share the same genetic origin as the Robert Fleming line.

We've had a few, albeit false, leads to the identities of the ancestors of Robert Fleming.  Our search continues.

We're happy to announce we have a new member to our group, a descendant of John Jackson & Mary Mullins Fleming thru their grandson Melvin (aka 'Big Melvin') Fleming.  On this note, all project members are encouraged to participate in the 'myGroups Page' which appears at the top of your FTDNA website. Merely click on 'Activity Feed' to submit a story, ask a question or post a picture.

Many of us are having good results from our autosomal (Family Finder) DNA test.  However, to facilitate finding your relatives, as well as being found by others, everyone is encouraged to complete their Family Tree on the FTDNA webpage.   Confirmation of matches also need to be posted on the FTDNA webpage as well.

FLEMING DNA PROJECT UPDATES—01/24/2011

A direct male descendant of Philip Fleming (1815-1885) was located and agreed to be tested. His test results match with tested male descendants of all of the sons of Robert Fleming (1773) except for the male descendants of Frederick Fleming that have currently been tested (to date, these men are descendants of either Frederick’s son John Jefferson Fleming (1855-1950) or son Solomon (1861). The project hopes to find a direct male descendant of Eligah Fleming (1865) (also a son of Frederick, and the only son whose male descendants have not been tested to date) that is willing to undergo a Y-DNA test. If direct male descendants of all of the sons of Frederick match each other, but do not match with the other sons of Robert Fleming (1773), the conclusion would be that an event outside of marriage took place prior to the birth of Frederick that makes him a non-biological child of Robert Fleming. The project could then spend time and resources trying to discover the paternal genetic origins of Frederick’s Y-DNA.

Direct male descendants of Robert Fleming (1773) that match each other: Philip (1815), John Jackson (1814), William (1823) and Robert Jefferson (1825) all show some slight mutations in their markers that are unique to some but not all of these genetic sons of Robert. Marker # DYS 447 shows the greatest diversity. The model for that marker is 25, and the John Jackson desc., Philip desc. and one of the descendants of Robert Jefferson Fleming all have the 25 marker value. However, both desc.s of Robert Jefferson Fleming via his son Philip have a 26 marker value and the one desc. Of William (Whiskey Bill) Fleming has a 26 value. This may tell us that a unique mutation has occurred at that marker for male desc.s of Philip, son of Robert Jefferson Fleming as well as for male desc.s of William Fleming.

A unique mutation shows up under DYS 576 for the male desc. of John Jackson Fleming. He shows a value of 17 for that marker—all of the other genetic descendants of Robert show a 18 value.

Finally, marker # DYS 460 has a model value of 12, but fully half of our tested genetic male descendants show a value of 11.

These observations may prove valuable in future comparisons with the Y-DNA of genetic male descendants of Robert Fleming to others w/different surnames who may represent a common ancestry with this line. At present, genetic male descendants of Robert Fleming do not have ANY close matches at a 37 or 67 marker level with anyone else—but, DO have a huge number of matches at the 25 marker level representing numerous surnames—nearly all of Irish origin.

FLEMING DNA PROJECT UPDATES--10/29/06

The first phase of the project seeks to test direct male descendants of each of the 5 sons of Robert Fleming (born circa 1773 in Ireland--died December 27, 1852 in Pike Co., KY; married Elizabeth Stembaugh, born circa 1785) in order to establish without a doubt the Y-DNA of the immigrant Robert Fleming.

The second phase of the project will be to look for genetic matches outside of the line of descent from Robert Fleming in order to advance the line further back. Family tradition states that Robert Fleming (1773) was a son of a William Fleming and wife, Jennie Buchanan. One hope of the project is to find and test (other) direct male descendants of this William Fleming. Another by-product of this second phase of the project will be to further document the paternal genetic ancestry of the line of Robert Fleming, and how that genetic ancestry fits into larger, older genetic lines.

Phase I – Testing & Documenting each of the sons of Robert Fleming (1773), the Immigrant.

Sons of Robert Fleming:

John Jackson Fleming (1810—1881; married Mary Mullins)

Philip Fleming (1815-1885; married Hannah Minerva Mullins)

Frederick Fleming (1820-1878; married Anna Wright)

William (Whiskey Bill) Fleming (1818—1906); married Elizabeth Mullins)

Robert Jefferson Fleming (1825-1893; married Lettie Mullins and 2) Margaret Rose).


FLEMING DNA PROJECT UPDATES—02/20/2010

02/20/2010— We have located and tested direct male descendants of all of the sons of Robert Fleming (1773) except for Philip Fleming (1815). Finding a direct male descendant of Philip Fleming (1815) is vital to the completion of the first phase of the project. Any direct male descendant of Philip Fleming (1815-1885; married Hannah Minerva Mullins in Pike Co., KY on July 5, 1838) who is willing to undergo a 37 marker Y-DNA test is urged to contact the Project Administrator at the following e-mail address: revel55@msn.com

Kit #66960 is a direct descendant of Frederick Fleming (1820--1878) Pike Co., KY. He is a direct male descendant of Frederick’s son Solomon (b. ca. 1861) who married Easter Branham, via Solomon’s son William Fleming (1896).

The results of the 37 marker Y-DNA test indicate that his suggested haplogroup is R1b, and that his ancient Y-DNA most closely matches with men from share an ancestry that connects them to County Meath in Leinster Provence, Ireland (note: Dublin is in County Meath). Kit #66960 is an exact match with:

Kit # 85566 who is a direct male descendant of Frederick Fleming (1820--1878) Pike Co., KY through his son John Jefferson Fleming (b. 12/11/1855—died 04/02/1950; married Mary Frances Johnson), via his son Solomon Fleming, known as Bad Sol (b. 1882).

At present, Kit #66960 has one single near match on the 37 marker level—the 35/37 match is with a man whose surname is Moore, whose oldest known ancestor came out of East Kentucky. Kit # 66960 also has three exact 25 marker matches: one is with the man whose surname is Moore; a second 25 marker match is with a descendant of a Larrin B. Morris, born circa 1859 in Georgia; a third 25 marker match is with a man whose surname is Owen, whose oldest known male ancestor is an Elijah Owen, born circa 1790, and died circa 1877. Elijah moved from NC to GA in the 1820s, and his last county of residence was Cherokee Co., GA. His father MAY have been a Peter Owen of Lunenburg Co., VA who moved to Orange Co., NC in the 1780s. There is also a 24 of 25 marker match with another man whose surname is Owen, whose oldest known male ancestor is a John W. Owen, born circa 1794 (no other information).

Kits # 57840 and 65680 are second cousins to each other and both are direct male descendants of Philip Fleming, son of Robert Jefferson Fleming and Lettie Mullins. Their haplogroup has been proven via Deep Clade Testing to be R1b1b2a1b5b. They carry the genetic mutation M222 that has been associated with the Ui Neill Dynasty through a 5th Century High King of Ireland named Niall of the Nine Hostages. Their markers and proven haplogroup most closely matches with men from the Mid-Ulster region (Counties Londonderry and Tyrone) of Ulster Provence, Ireland. Kits # 57840 and 65680 are off Model at markers 460 (they are at the value of 11; the Model is 12) and marker #CDYa (they are at a value of 39 (the Model is 38). These mutations seem to be unique to the male line of descent of Philip Fleming, son of Robert Jefferson Fleming and Lettie Mullins. Aside from the mutations mentioned, Kits # 57840 and 65680 match with the Y-DNA test results for kits # 79678, 73163, and 166018.

Kit #73163 is a direct male descendant of William Fleming, known as “Red Billy” who was another son of Robert Jefferson Fleming and Lettie Mullins. William was born circa 1852 and died in 1911. He married 1) Rebecca Rose, and 2) Lydia Robinson. The test results for kit # 73163 show that he matches with kits # 57840, 65680, 79678, and 166018. In fact, his markers represent the “Model” for the Y-DNA of Robert Fleming (17730).

Kit # 79678 is a direct male descendant of John Jackson Fleming (1814-1881 who married Mary Mullins) who was his great-great-grandfather via his son Emanuel Fleming (who married Margaret Mullins, daughter of Isom and Polly (Sanders) Mullins). The test results of Kit # 79678 match with test results of kits # 73163, 57840, 65680 and 166018. Kit # 79678 is off Model at markers 458 (with a value of 18; the Model is 17) and marker #454 with a value of 12 (the Model is 11). These mutations appear to be unique to the John Jackson Fleming line.

Kit # 166018 is a direct male descendant of Robert Fleming (1773)’s son William (Whiskey Bill) Fleming (b. ca. 18 23 and died in 1906), who married Elizabeth Mullins. Test results show that his Y-DNA matches with kits # 79678, 73163, 57840, and 65680. Kit # 166018 is one marker shy of the Model; this mutation occurs in marker #447 and with a marker value of 24 (the model value is 25).

Conclusions (based on the data at present):

The test results for 5 project members who are descendants of 3 of the 4 sons of Robert Fleming (1773) exactly match each others Y-DNA (other than mutations unique to their branch or line of descent). Those 3 sons are John Jackson, Robert Jefferson, and William Fleming. Their markers are matches with the genetic markers known variously as the Niall Nóigiallach, or Niall of the Nine Hostages markers. These markers are the genetic fingerprint of Niall Nóigiallach, or Niall of the Nine Hostages (one of the High Kings of Ireland, who lived some 1700 years ago). His Y-DNA is synonymous with that of the descendants of the Ui Neill Kings who ruled Ireland for over 700 years. Ui Neill is pronounced EE NEEL, and literally means ‘descendants of Niall.’ Additionally, the genetic signature of these 3 of the 4 sons of Robert Fleming (1773) match with what is known as the “Y-STR Irish Modal Haplotype,” leaving little doubt of the ancient Irish ancestry of the lineage.

The test results for the two project members who are descendants of Frederick Fleming (via 2 of his 3 known sons) also exactly match each other. Likewise, they also indicate an Irish origin, but the test results show a suggested haplogroup that most genetically matches with men from County Meath in Ireland. Astonishingly, the test results of their Y-DNA does not match with the test results of the project members who are direct male descendants of John Jackson, Robert Jefferson, and William Fleming—3 of the 5 sons of Robert Fleming (1773). This suggests the probability of a break in the paternal line of either Frederick Fleming himself or at least two of his three sons. Testing of a direct male descendant of Elijah A. Fleming (b. ca 1865, who married Martha J. Hall) who was the third son of Frederick Fleming could possibly prove or disprove when the genetic break occurred--at the birth of Frederick Fleming (1820) or at the birth of at least two of Frederick’s sons. I urge any direct male descendants of Elijah A. Fleming who would be agreeable to a 37 marker Y-DNA test to contact the Project Administer at: revel55@msn.com

One of the projects deliverables thus far has been to confirm that the Fleming family that descends from Robert Fleming and Elizabeth (Stembaugh) Fleming has an undeniable paternal genetic origin that is indigenously Irish—not Flemish, Norman, Scottish, Welsh or English. How the family acquired the Flemish surname of “Fleming” is still a mystery—now, even more so, as the test results of the male descendants of Robert Fleming do not match with any other test results from others with the surname Fleming and they show an unmistakable paternal genetic link to Ireland that is many centuries old.

The Project continues to seek direct male descendants of Frederick Fleming, John Jackson Fleming, William Fleming, and Philip Fleming to participate in this important genetic testing. We are also constantly on the look-out for other matches of significance that we hope will one day expand our ancestral lineage back beyond Robert Fleming (1773).